I seem to have stumbled upon another bug. This time when the font size is changed to any other value but font size 3 tags are added. However if font size 3 is selected no tags are created. I'm guessing this is because the default font size for the editor is 3, so the editor is simply being economical with its tags, however with our site the rich text can appear in several different places, where the default font size may not be 3, so for this reason we need the font tags added every time regardless. Is there a fix or workaround for this besides adding the font size=3 tag every location where rich text will be displayed? I traced the function to _format and then gave up as i think this may be some kind of function which is called by the editor itself and not something within win.js Thanks again Rich Halliwell